The National Defense Authorization Bill: Renaming army bases.

[Matt McKeon]

In the massive ND bill that just passed over President Trump's veto, there is a provision to rename military bases currently named for CSA generals.

 

[rittmeister]

In the massive ND bill that just passed over President Trump's veto, there is a provision to rename military bases currently named for CSA generals.

was about time

 

[Matt McKeon]

was about time

Of all the issues facing the country right now, I can't say this is the first on the list. But it does send a message.

Possible new bases names? There should be a George C. Marshall one somewhere.

 

[rittmeister]

Of all the issues facing the country right now, I can't say this is the first on the list. But it does send a message.

Possible new bases names? There should be a George C. Marshall one somewhere.

big sign - i can't remember a raf marseille or somesuch

 

[Wehrkraftzersetzer]

big sign - i can't remember a raf marseille or somesuch

Never say never

There might be a Polish Base / Barracks called Rommel

 

[5fish]

But it does send a message.

There enough MoN members to find new names for these bases and another nail in our confederate past...

 

[diane]

I hope they don't over-compensate, carefully consider the new names. Ben Nighthorse Campbell led the successful effort to rename the Custer Battlefield the Little Big Horn Battlefield. This led to fair representation of both sides, so renaming is not a bad idea.

 

[Wehrkraftzersetzer]

carefully consider the new names

Fort Crazy Horse?

 

[diane]

Beat ya to it!

Navajo Nation Leaders Urge Trump, Congress To Rename Military Bases In Honor Of Native Americans

WINDOW ROCK — With the demand that military bases named after Confederate military figures be renamed, the leaders of the Navajo Nation are urging congressional leaders and the White House to honor Native American people. Navajo Nation President Jonathan Nez and Vice President Myron Lizer...

arizonadailyindependent.com

 

[rittmeister]

Never say never

There might be a Polish Base / Barracks called Rommel

yawn!

 

[5fish]

Beat ya to it!

I do want to rain on the parade...

Fort Crazy Horse?

I remember this debate about using Native people's names like extinct tribes for sports teams like high school, college, and pro was offensive to Native activists. They complained it implied Native people's were warmongers. It implied that native people's were violent. Now, you all want a military base name after a native person... you can not have your cake and eat it too...

I have another complaint if you name it after someone who took up arms against my government that is a no no... That is just like naming bases after confederates...

If you name a base after a native person that served in our military that is okay but we are back to the first problem...

 

[diane]

I do want to rain on the parade...



I remember this debate about using Native people's names like extinct tribes for sports teams like high school, college, and pro was offensive to Native activists. They complained it implied Native people's were warmongers. It implied that native people's were violent. Now, you all want a military base name after a native person... you can not have your cake and eat it too...

I have another complaint if you name it after someone who took up arms against my government that is a no no... That is just like naming bases after confederates...

If you name a base after a native person that served in our military that is okay but we are back to the first problem...

It's always a problem when you name things after people because images and interpretations of them change, or something hidden pops out that makes everybody gag. Let's take your Natives are violent - military helicopters are all named for Indians, missiles, bombs and so forth. Interestingly, the military asked the tribes if they minded - they gave their consent. So...it's ok with the Apache if a violent item like the Apache helicopter is named after them. And, all the powwows begin with honor songs for the veterans - we have a lot of non-Indian vets in the ceremony as all warriors are respected.

Taking up arms against your government is an issue you have with the Confederates, not Indians. I see nothing wrong with repelling foreign invasion, do you? Military bases aren't forts - may have that word in their name but the function of 19th century forts was far different from modern military bases. Lots and lots of Native American American soldiers, too, and a lot of them Medal of Honor recipients.

 

[5fish]

Taking up arms against your government is an issue you have with the Confederates, not Indians. I see nothing wrong with repelling foreign invasion, do you? Military bases aren't forts - may have that word in their name but the function of 19th century forts was far different from modern military bases. Lots and lots of Native American American soldiers, too, and a lot of them Medal of Honor recipients.

Is does not matter if we were concidered invaders or not... You shot at an American in war. You are an enemy of the American government... You can use any native american that fought for an American cause... We are back to the first issue... Using indian names to promote violence which was the reason to strip indian names off stuff in the first place...

 

[Jim Klag]

Is does not matter if we were concidered invaders or not... You shot at an American in war. You are an enemy of the American government... You can use any native american that fought for American cause... We are back to the first issue... Using indian names to promote violence which was the reason to strip indian names off stuff in the first place...

Unlike the confederates, the Native Americans were indeed invaded; their women and children slaughtered; their people denied the right to practice their religion, wear their own clothes or speak their own languages; they were driven from their homes and forced to live in concentration camps/reservations. Theirs was a classic case of self-defense when they took up arms.

 

[rittmeister]

Is does not matter if we were concidered invaders or not... You shot at an American in war. You are an enemy of the American government... You can use any native american that fought for an American cause... We are back to the first issue... Using indian names to promote violence which was the reason to strip indian names off stuff in the first place...

bollocks

 

[5fish]

Unlike the confederates, the Native Americans were indeed invaded; their women and children slaughtered; their people denied the right to practice their religion, wear their own clothes or speak their own languages; they were driven from their homes and forced to live in concentration camps/reservations. Theirs was a classic case of self-defense when they took up arms.

Wait... Do you call killing American women, children, and unarmed men self defense? ... Native Americans gave back in needless violence to us as well. Yes, we an advance society drove them from their lands and killed numerously... It was war and we conquered them... They were fighting for a just cause and we were fighting to defend our settlers, miners, ranchers, and so forth... Again, they took up arms against our nation and paid the price...

 

[5fish]

bollocks

Now, do you consider the German Northern crusades unjust bringing the faith to the pagans... Did you not make their lives better in the end... that the issue we did not make Native lives better once the wats were over...

 

[Jim Klag]

Wait... Do you call killing American women, children, and unarmed men self defense? ... Native Americans gave back in needless violence to us as well. Yes, we an advance society drove them from their lands and killed numerously... It was war and we conquered them... They were fighting for a just cause and we were fighting to defend our settlers, miners, ranchers, and so forth... Again, they took up arms against our nation and paid the price...

You, sir, are full of bovine scatology. American men, women and children killed by Indians were, each and evry one, trespassing on Indian land, cutting down their forests, hunting on their land and building cabins on their land. You must look at it from their point of view. If someone came to your house, burned it down, killed the kids and the animals, cut down all the trees in the yard and then built a new house on your land, what would you do? When the British invaded us in 1812, we did exactly the same as the Indians. We defended our land. There is precisely zero difference between the two actions.

 

[diane]

Is does not matter if we were concidered invaders or not... You shot at an American in war. You are an enemy of the American government... You can use any native american that fought for an American cause... We are back to the first issue... Using indian names to promote violence which was the reason to strip indian names off stuff in the first place...

No offense, 5fish, but stripping Indian names off of stuff is going to be a major challenge! We'll have to rename at least ten states for starters... You don't think we were Americans by birth, do you? Why would the United States make treaties with its own people? Probably because they weren't its own people but sovereign nations.

 

[diane]

Now, do you consider the German Northern crusades unjust bringing the faith to the pagans... Did you not make their lives better in the end... that the issue we did not make Native lives better once the wats were over...

Once the wars were over, it pretty much sucked to be us. Remaking somebody into your own image does not necessarily mean an improvement - which goes for everybody in history - it just means you won the conquest and now can enforce your will.