The Case for Reparations

byron ed said:

And btw, if the info actually came from the AP why didn't you post that as the source?

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Here is an article about the AP...


AP has been the gold standard for calling races for decades. Many (if not most) news organizations look to them on election night and share the AP’s reporting and election calls with their audiences. Here’s one explanation of how that works from NPR.

Jim Klag said:

I wasn't pulling anyone's leg.

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This is what I call pulling a leg or chain, it's of Italian manufacture btw. Note that it says Fra-gi-lee.

5fish said:

The economic damage done to Black Americas in the 20th century ,could be address in tort laws with rumination for restitution and recompense for their injuries. A dollar value can be found...

1) we know who owned the land taken by whites through out the south and its value than and now...
2) we know which neighborhoods were red lined and who lived there over the years and can put a price on it
3) we know which houses and addresses and who live in them were bulldozed to make way for highways and attached a price to it
4) we know which Black soldier served in the military and we can put a price on how they were cheated out of the G I Bill...

The think a case for restitution and recompense can be made and won in a court of law...

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We now can add number 5) environmental racism for we know the neighborhoods and towns where waste was dumped and where dirty industries were located so restitution and recompense can be done...

Here is a town stepping up to right a wrong the past... read and see the future... @O' Be Joyful . @Joshism , @Jim Klag , @diane , @rittmeister , @Wehrkraftzersetzer , @jgoodguy


snip...

For years, Robin Rue Simmons watched Evanston, Illinois, “working hard” to resolve its racial disparities – but with little to show for its efforts.

“Our gaps were widening,” the city alderman told the Guardian, citing the Chicago suburb’s declining black population and other issues. “I thought we were being delusional to continue in the same vein and believe we would bridge the gap.”

So, Rue Simmons began plotting a new, stronger approach to addressing racial inequality in Evanston: a local reparations for slavery program for African Americans, similar to those proposed on the federal scale.

A note maybe the Indians can learn from this...

5fish said:

Here is a town stepping up to right a wrong the past... read and see the future... @O' Be Joyful . @Joshism , @Jim Klag , @diane , @rittmeister , @Wehrkraftzersetzer , @jgoodguy

One city's reparations program that could offer a blueprint for the nation

Evanston, Illinois, is levying a tax on newly legalised marijuana to fund projects benefiting African Americans in recognition of the enduring effects of slavery and the war on drugs

www.theguardian.com

snip...

For years, Robin Rue Simmons watched Evanston, Illinois, “working hard” to resolve its racial disparities – but with little to show for its efforts.

“Our gaps were widening,” the city alderman told the Guardian, citing the Chicago suburb’s declining black population and other issues. “I thought we were being delusional to continue in the same vein and believe we would bridge the gap.”

So, Rue Simmons began plotting a new, stronger approach to addressing racial inequality in Evanston: a local reparations for slavery program for African Americans, similar to those proposed on the federal scale.

A note maybe the Indians can learn from this...

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why are you always paging me with stuff? thisone is not a german topic. it's not a topic i'm particularily invested in (posted twice on page1 - my other posts are not material). i prever being paged for stuff that intrigues me.

... and btw, i do get an alert for everything that happens anyway

rittmeister said:

i prever being paged for stuff that intrigues me.

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I paged you to history in the making... first reparations to African Americans...

5fish said:

I paged you to history in the making... first reparations to African Americans...

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Wrong. I believe "40 acres and a mule" was more than 150 years ahead of Evanston. This was real personal reparations.

In fact, the results of a recent Associated Press-NORC poll indicated 74 percent of Black Americans now favor reparations payments, while 85 percent of white Americans oppose them. The split is staggering. So how will that fulfill the pledge of President Biden and the Democrats to bring about unity in America?

Jim Klag said:

I believe "40 acres and a mule"

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This never happened

Jim Klag said:

than 150 years ahead of Evanston.

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But this is happening , now...

5fish said:

This never happened

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Excuse me!? It really happened. "Forty acres and a mule is part of Special Field Orders No. 15, a wartime order proclaimed by Union General William Tecumseh Sherman on January 16, 1865."

Gen Ormsby Mitchell, a remarkable man who was killed early in the war and thus forgotten, had the original 40 acres and a mule idea. He put 'contrabands' on land in South Carolina, made sure whites left them alone, and let them have their freedom. His experiment proved a whole lot of notions about blacks were just fig leaves for slavery. They did well and prospered...until they didn't. Sherman revived the idea - his was the famous saying - and he took their slice out of the planters' pie. Didn't take them long to go to court and get their land back...and kick the blacks off. To add to the injuries, Sherman also took sizable quantities of Indian land to give to the freedmen...and this is another twist to the blacks-on-tribal-rolls problem. Reparations can't be used as it is being used now - for gain of temporary political points.

Jim Klag said:

Excuse me!?

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I think your argument fails at a closer look....

From you article so we will give a for effort and a half star... You seemed to leave out the Government take bakes( those Indian Givers)... We sell X-slaves lands the flood regularly...

Some land redistribution occurred under military jurisdiction during the war and for a brief period thereafter. However, federal and state policy during the Reconstruction era emphasized wage labor, not land ownership, for black people. Almost all land allocated during the war was restored to its pre-war white owners. Several black communities did maintain control of their land, and some families obtained new land by homesteading. Black land ownership increased markedly in Mississippi during the 19th century, particularly. The state had much undeveloped bottomland (low-lying alluvial land near a river) behind riverfront areas that had been cultivated before the war. Most blacks acquired land through private transactions, with ownership peaking at 15,000,000 acres (6,100,000 ha) in 1910, before an extended financial recession caused problems that resulted in the loss of property for many.

Jim Klag said:

Special Field Orders No. 15,

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Here from you article... President Indian Giver...

However, Abraham Lincoln's successor as president, Andrew Johnson, explicitly reversed and annulled proclamations such as Special Field Orders No. 15 and the Freedmen's Bureau bills.

5fish said:

I think your argument fails at a closer look....

From you article so we will give a for effort and a half star... You seemed to leave out the Government take bakes( those Indian Givers)... We sell X-slaves lands the flood regularly...

Some land redistribution occurred under military jurisdiction during the war and for a brief period thereafter. However, federal and state policy during the Reconstruction era emphasized wage labor, not land ownership, for black people. Almost all land allocated during the war was restored to its pre-war white owners. Several black communities did maintain control of their land, and some families obtained new land by homesteading. Black land ownership increased markedly in Mississippi during the 19th century, particularly. The state had much undeveloped bottomland (low-lying alluvial land near a river) behind riverfront areas that had been cultivated before the war. Most blacks acquired land through private transactions, with ownership peaking at 15,000,000 acres (6,100,000 ha) in 1910, before an extended financial recession caused problems that resulted in the loss of property for many.



Here from you article... President Indian Giver...

However, Abraham Lincoln's successor as president, Andrew Johnson, explicitly reversed and annulled proclamations such as Special Field Orders No. 15 and the Freedmen's Bureau bills.

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Remember - nothing has yet been done in Evanston except a city council vote. And some folks DID get their 40 acres and a mule.

Jim Klag said:

Evanston except a city council vote.

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But there are other cities thinking of doing it....


Another article...

Curious about something. Does that mean the reparations (and that's the term that was legally used) to black farmers taken out of the Indian Cobell settlement will be repaid to Indians, since the black farmers are now to receive their own reparations? It would have been so much easier and far more just to pay the freed slaves for their labor - the going rate, too, not slave wages - so they could get themselves going. Oh, wait, can't have that... They might buy the plantation from master and hire him to pick cotton!

5fish said:

But there are other cities thinking of doing it....

'The timing is right for reparations': Cities propose reparations amid nationwide unrest

Providence, Rhode Island, and Asheville, North Carolina, address the role of slavery by considering reparations. Congress is also considering a reparations bill.

www.usatoday.com

Another article...

Cities are considering reparations to repay the debt of slavery, but can they? - The Boston Globe

As Providence and other cities consider reparations, some scholars argue that the nation owes a moral and financial debt to Black Americans that exceeds what any municipal government can pay.

www.bostonglobe.com

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Still just words until something actually happens.

Who would be more responsible for reparations?
Africa (the original enslavers), the kings and queens of Europe (the original importers of slaves to the New World), or the United States?

Tom said:

Who would be more responsible for reparations?
Africa (the original enslavers), the kings and queens of Europe (the original importers of slaves to the New World), or the United States?

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hm? who could be sued in an us court?

rittmeister said:

hm? who could be sued in an us court?

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What about an international court?

Tom said:

What about an international court?

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is there an international court the us is subscribed to? i think i remember one of your presidents threatening to send in the marines if a certain international court dared to put americans into the dock

one really got a problem to sue in a court one's nation doesn't subscribe to, doesn't one think?