Bibles of the Civil War

I found this article about Bibles used in the Civil War I want to note there is a Bible with two bullet holes through it... it save a man's life in two different battles... The article is interesting from a history and religious view points...

https://hbu.edu/museums/dunham-bibl...useum/past-exhibits/they-read-the-same-bible/

Americans of the 19th century were a Bible-reading people. As Abraham Lincoln noted, pondering the meaning of the Civil War in his Second Inaugural Address, both sides “read the same Bible.” The Bible was accepted as the Word of God, an authority and guide for life. As solders faced physical hardships, separation from their loved ones, the horrors of battle, and the possibility of debilitating wounds or death words from Scripture often gave them spiritual strength for the difficult times.

5fish said:

I found this article about Bibles used in the Civil War I want to note there is a Bible with two bullet holes through it... it save a man's life in two different battles... The article is interesting from a history and religious view points...

https://hbu.edu/museums/dunham-bibl...useum/past-exhibits/they-read-the-same-bible/

Americans of the 19th century were a Bible-reading people. As Abraham Lincoln noted, pondering the meaning of the Civil War in his Second Inaugural Address, both sides “read the same Bible.” The Bible was accepted as the Word of God, an authority and guide for life. As solders faced physical hardships, separation from their loved ones, the horrors of battle, and the possibility of debilitating wounds or death words from Scripture often gave them spiritual strength for the difficult times.

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Actually, there were at least two different bibles - the King James and the Catholic bibles. There were a couple different versions of the Catholic bible (different translators) with minor differences. The Catholic bible was a straight translation of the ancient texts, the King James was just that - King James' version of the bible. A lot of literary fig leaves were added and verses that the king's committee found vulgar were deleted or revised and lines were added that were not in the ancient texts.

5fish said:

I found this article about Bibles used in the Civil War I want to note there is a Bible with two bullet holes through it... it save a man's life in two different battles...

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Just to note, such stories and artifacts are a flag for historians. It was way too easy to shoot a bible, diary, pocket watch, belt buckle or chest plate, even post-war, and claim life-saving provenance for it. This was grist for old bragging veteran's stories and newspaper clips (on slow-news days) for decades after the war. As photos were made reproducible in newspapers into the next century, such stories were revived in local newspapers across the country -- especially showing the aged vet holding the item. An additional incentive to promote these stories after the vets all died off was that the monetary value of items increased many times over the same artifact without a bullet dent*

As photos were made reproducible in newspapers, such artifacts as bibles, buckles, and hats with bullet marks were a sure read in local newspapers across the country -- especially photos with the old vet holding the item. Such items boosted the attraction of local history museums as well, especially the "mom-n-pop" / UDC museums of the South.

Generally, the veracity of stories behind bullet-dented artifacts can be considered but a notch or so below stories of "women soldiers," and of course lately "Black Confederates." In all those cases rare incidents were true but most are seriously unverified.



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*witness a certain "master of CW dug relics" on the "other" forum site who consistently talks-up the value of pitted rusty junk to an admiring cadre of duped peers - the webmaster included. Also witness that Confederate dug items seem to bring the highest price -- this is nothing less than a contiguous attempt to glorify the worth of the Confederate cause, in other words it's merely "Lost Cause" in a different form, as if one Confederate junk is worth ten Union junks. It's not African-American collectors putting out the extra bucks for Confederate junk.

byron ed said:

In all those cases rare incidents were true but most are seriously unverified.

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I wasn't aware there were degrees of "unverified" - sort of like degrees of pregnancy.

Jim Klag said:

I wasn't aware there were degrees of "unverified" - sort of like degrees of pregnancy.

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Then be aware, and you're welcome. There's totally degrees of verification/"unverification" in the study of the Civil War. Some things are substantially verified while others have shaky verification. As you know the spread between substantial and shaky is literally the grist of so many conversations here (i.e. secession, Grant's drinking, Fort Pillow, Black Confederates etc etc etc).

Pregnancy has no such degrees of verification -- a woman is verified pregnant or not.

A sound bite, to be successful, requires at least the appearance of a truth. Barring that, a naughty word or two might work.

byron ed said:

Then be aware, and you're welcome. There's totally degrees of verification/"unverification" in the study of the Civil War. Some things are substantially verified while others have shaky verification. As you know the spread between substantial and shaky is literally the grist of so many conversations here (i.e. secession, Grant's drinking, Fort Pillow, Black Confederates etc etc etc).

Pregnancy has no such degrees of verification -- a woman is verified pregnant or not.

A sound bite, to be successful, requires at least the appearance of a truth. Barring that, a naughty word or two might work.

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Yes, but how is something "seriously unverified?"

byron ed said:

Some things are substantially verified while others have shaky verification.

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I think a question having "shaky" verification is just plain unverified and one that is "substantially" verified is just plain verified.

Jim Klag said:

"shaky"

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I found this video so is it verified and unverified...


I do not it in a small museum like @byron ed mentioned...

I found this I think the sweetheart need to get all the credit .... a paragraph read..


At another time a bullet hit the New Testament he was carrying in his shirt pocket and glanced off. This sweetheart, who later became his wife, had given him the New Testament when he entered the service.

I found this site list a few stories about Bibles saving lives in battle...

Jim Klag said:

Yes, but how is something "seriously unverified?"

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I can't imagine how something can be"seriously unverified," haven't heard that one before. Things are substantially verified, shakily verified or not verified at all. There's no great mystery to this.

Shakily verified are things like secession, Grant's drinking, Fort Pillow, Black Confederates, and (usually) life-saving shot bibles.

Jim Klag said:

I think a question having "shaky" verification is just plain unverified and one that is "substantially" verified is just plain verified.

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I'll respond as if this were a serious push-back, but of course I recognize what's really going on, a bit of leg-pulling; an attempt to pull-off a "who's on first" thing or whatever.

So seriously then, verification is not a light switch, it's a dimmer.

Once again, the spread is literally the grist of so many conversations here. To whit how long have we been gunning each other about secession? One person's substantial verification is another person's shaky verification. There's no great mystery to this. There's no black-and-white to this.

5fish said:

I found this video so is it verified and unverified...[cappersfarmer.com/humor-and-nostalgias bible-saves-soldiers-life]...[civil-war-picket.blogspot.com/2016/04/saving-my-soul-bullet-struck-bibles]...

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Whatever is meant by "verified and unverified" -- an oxymoron btw -- these are two good examples of shaky verification, and thanks for making the case. Here we have two long-post-war second-hand accounts, one from a "humor and nostalgia" page of a farmer's magazine, and the other a quote from a current civil war maven's blog, neither source providing references or claiming any academic research.

btw on that second source, notice "Ben Greenbaum, co-owner of Perry Adams Antiques, said his firm brokered the Bible." Profit motive. Suspect.

To be clear, I think such stories are entertaining. And I believe there were genuine instances of a bullet being stopped by a bible, if rare. Most of these stories have shaky provenance, meh. I could find an old period bible (they are not rare) and shoot it with my Remington two-bander musket and call it a day as well.

byron ed said:

I can't imagine how something can be"seriously unverified," haven't heard that one before. Things are substantially verified, shakily verified or not verified at all. There's no great mystery to this.

Shakily verified are things like secession, Grant's drinking, Fort Pillow, Black Confederates, and (usually) life-saving shot bibles.

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Read your own previous post #3 - the underlined passage.

Jim Klag said:

Read your own previous post #3 - the underlined passage.

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byron ed said:

...Generally, the veracity of stories behind bullet-dented artifacts can be considered but a notch or so below stories of "women soldiers," and of course lately "Black Confederates." In all those cases rare incidents were true but most are seriously unverified...

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and yet

byron ed said:

...I can't imagine how something can be"seriously unverified,"...

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and still be considered valid, as in the case of these CW bullet-dented items. That's the point I was making, if that was unclear.

Bottom line, who here will accept just about any story about bullets stopped by a diary, pocket watch, belt buckle, chest plate or bible because it's a cute story. We are entertained by such stories which apparently precludes any serious research into the story. We are motivated as providers of clever stories -- to win friends and influence people with our insider knowledge.

Again, to be clear I believe there were genuine instances of a bullet being stopped by a bible, if rare.

I'll bring up another cute story we hear occasionally: Underage recruits would place a piece of paper under their shoe with the number "18" written on it, so they could "honestly" claim to be "over 18" for the benefit of the recruiter (as if they were any more honest in doing that than just out-and-out misrepresenting their age). Cute story, but like "bibles stopping bullets" it maybe happened a few times at most, and very few of those instances more than shakily verified.

byron ed said:

and yet


and still be considered valid, as in the case of these CW bullet-dented items. That's the point I was making, if that was unclear.

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Nice try. Shameless seems apropos.

Well... There is an unverified verified case of a packet of love letters saving a guy's life! He decided to keep his beloved close to his heart always, which meant stuffing her letters into his coat pocket. Do hymnals count? There's a case of that, too - happened to be holding it chest level singing!

Incredible near misses in a fight are more common than it seems!

Jim Klag said:

Nice try. Shameless seems apropos.

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Nice try at what? My contribution has been to advise that the sort of stories in the OP need a deeper dive. Your contribution, as far as I can tell, is to bring up "pregnancy" (and now "shame") and two more equally-shaky examples of things that need a deeper dive.

Plainly, historical things are substantially verified, shakily verified or not verified at all.

This thread is about an old-book-with-a-hole-in-it, nothing to get especially worked-up about, meh.

byron ed said:

old-book-with-a-hole-in-it,

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I think we should take them for face value because we know at least one or more soldiers were saved by a Bible in their pocket... It does make for a good feel good story... folklore or not....

5fish said:

... we know at least one or more soldiers were saved by a Bible in their pocket...It does make for a good feel good story... folklore or not....

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Yes, we've accepted one or more accounts of bullet-stopping bibles ...not exactly the same thing as "knowing" the stories are true but we trust that they are. And I'm in total agreement these are feel good stories, folklore or not -- but what are we serious CW mavens supposed to do with that?

Here's what we do know:

a) Artifacts with a bullet dent or hole are worth many times more than an identical artifact without the dent or hole -- from a newspaper readership standpoint, from an old vet's war tales standpoint, and from an outright dollar standpoint. All forms of profit.

b) That there are sooo many surviving artifacts with bullet dents and holes out there is suspect. It's a common phenom that serious collectors and museums will scrutinize while hack collectors and mom n' pop museums merely celebrate. Both reactions are evident here.

c) Such artifacts are easy to manufacture. Take a rusty dug scabbard worth maybe $25., add a bullet dent and its a rusty dug scabbard worth $250., then add Confederate provenance and it's a rusty dug scabbard worth $2,500. (at least to white collectors).

d) Most "pocket bibles" were not that, but rather new testaments or psalms that actually fit into a vest pocket. It's suspect that a complete St. James bible would be carried in a vest pocket rather than a haversack for how thick it would have to be at that size. Yet a bullet to the butt is not the story we hear -- it's always a bullet to the heart ...hmmm.

byron ed said:

Yet a bullet to the butt is not the story we hear -- it' always a bullet to the heart ...hmmm.

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Your solution: When the legend becomes fact, print the legend.” yes, its always the heart...

@O' Be Joyful will like this clip...