To erect a suitable Monument to their memory

Andersonh1

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Address of Hon. B. F. Jonas
at the laying of the corner stone of the monument
to the memory of the Confederate Dead at Baton Rouge
February 22d, 1886

Hopkins Printing Office, 22 Commercial Place, New Orleans 1886


Benjamin Jonas was a Democrat US Senator from Louisiana, the third Jew to ever serve in the US Senate, and during the war rose to the rank of Major in the Confederate Army, after joining in 1862 and serving in the artillery in the Army of Tennessee. His status as a veteran and a US Senator would have made him a prominent figure to speak at the laying of the cornerstone, and he had a few thoughts about the meaning of this monument.

The monument of which you lay the corner-stone to-day will be built in commemoration of no particular chieftain or hero, although you sent many from your midst well deserving of such honor, but in memory of a class whose patriotism, self-sacrificing devotion and heroism command the admiration of the people from whose bosom they went forth, as in time to come they will command the respect and reverence of all Americans.​
The monument which is to be erected by the patriotic ladies and citizens of Baton Rouge in memory of the Confederate soldiers from the Florida parishes who died in the war will one day be regarded by all Americans with the same pride and veneration as the monuments in your National Cemetery, which do merited honor to the heroes lying there who died on the other side.​
---------------​
I walk through the national cemeteries and the quiet ranks of the dead with respect and reverence. I honor the sentiment in the nation which thus guards and protects the memory of those who died that it should live. While serving in the Senate I voted with pleasure for every appropriation asked for for the purpose of beautifying and improving these grounds and their monuments. The noble stanzas written by a gallant Confederate soldier, now dead, which, cast upon enduring metal, adorn their walks and gates, thrill my every pulse with sympathy as I gaze upon the "bivouac of the dead." But while conceding to the fullest extent the honor to the victor, while claiming nothing from the government for the conquered, in pensions for the living or burial for the dead, I yet claim for them the right which belongs to all brave men, victor or vanquished, to honor the memory of their comrades who died in battle, to erect monumennts over their graves, or in commemoration of their valor, devotion and self-sacrifice, though their resting places may be unknown and their bivouac not "On fame's eternal camping ground."​
-----------------------​
Under its folds we are assembled to-day, we surviving soldiers of the Confederate army, with many of those who fought against us as our honored guests, to inaugurate a monument to those who fell in battle or died in the service on our side. There is nothing of treason, nothing of disloyalty in this. The men whom we desire to honor, less fortunate than we, were able to illustrate their patriotism only by dying for their cause. Had they survived they would have accepted the result as we did, and would have battled as courageously against poverty and discouragement to restore their country to peace and its former prosperity. They would as proudly have upheld its banner, and stood as ready to do battle in its defense. As departed American soldiers, their records are as bright, their spirits as pure and free from stain, their memories as glorious in all that speaks of duty nobly done, as if they slept as the nation's wards in yonder city of the dead.​
Living, they strove to do their duty. Dead, let no one challenge or criticise their motives. They have gone to a higher court for judgment. This stone is to be raised to commemorate their virtues, and the day will come, if it has not already dawned, when those virtues will be acknowledged of all men, when the Federal soldier and his descendants will stand uncovered before this monument, as we bare our heads when we pass through their cities of the dead.​
-------------------​
In memory, I see again these regiments and battalions starting for the front, with music and banners and all the panoply of war, and memory brings back to me, and to all of you, the recollection of loved faces and brave hearts of many who were marching in the ranks, and who are absent from our gathering to-day, who will respond to lifes roll call no more forever— who are memories now. Of those whom to-day we honor. We cannot strew flowers upon their scattered graves ; we cannot mark their unknown resting places with stone or monument; we cannot gather their earthly spoil into beautiful mausoleums, or cities of the dead, but we erect this monument in their honor that all people in all time to come may know that the soldiers who died for the Confederate cause are not without love and honor and reverence in the land which gave them birth:
 
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Tom

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You have source on that ?
Kirk's Raiders
Testimony of Major Williams, Private, Company B, 6th US Heavy Artillery (USCT):
"Major Bradford brought in a black flag, which meant no quarter."

Report of Lt. Daniel Van Horn, Company D, 6th US Heavy Artillery (USCT):
"There never was a surrender of the fort, both officers and men declaring they never would surrender or ask for quarter."
 

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USCT initiated the rule of "no quarter" at Fort Pillow. In fact, they had an actual black flag inside the fort.
That threat didn't work out very well for them.

The USCT initiated the rule of "no quarter" at the Battle of the Crater. They murdered wounded Confederates.
The tables eventually turned on them.

No.... I read the history of both of these events and you have been misinformed... As far as I know no Union units ever declared "no quarter" before a fight or during a fight.
 

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Report of Lt. Daniel Van Horn, Company D, 6th US Heavy Artillery (USCT):
"There never was a surrender of the fort, both officers and men declaring they never would surrender or ask for quarter."
This means the men of the fort would not surrender under any reason but as we know many a Color soldier ask for quarter instead were killed.
 

5fish

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Testimony of Major Williams, Private, Company B, 6th US Heavy Artillery (USCT):
"Major Bradford brought in a black flag, which meant no quarter."
Here is the story first he the only Union soldiers to make this commit about Bradford. It only agreed that Bradford was not going to surrender the fort at any cost. Here is a link to story : it seems Bradford was signaling a Gunboat New Era with a dark blue flag .... The link:

 

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Testimony of Major Williams, Private, Company B, 6th US Heavy Artillery (USCT):
"Major Bradford brought in a black flag, which meant no quarter."

Report of Lt. Daniel Van Horn, Company D, 6th US Heavy Artillery (USCT):
"There never was a surrender of the fort, both officers and men declaring they never would surrender or ask for quarter."
Good soldiers don't surrender. If the USCT soldiers surendered they faced either death or slavery.
No reason to trust the Confederate soldiers.
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Address of Hon. B. F. Jonas
at the laying of the corner stone of the monument
to the memory of the Confederate Dead at Baton Rouge
February 22d, 1886

Hopkins Printing Office, 22 Commercial Place, New Orleans 1886


Benjamin Jonas was a Democrat US Senator from Louisiana, the third Jew to ever serve in the US Senate, and during the war rose to the rank of Major in the Confederate Army, after joining in 1862 and serving in the artillery in the Army of Tennessee. His status as a veteran and a US Senator would have made him a prominent figure to speak at the laying of the cornerstone, and he had a few thoughts about the meaning of this monument.

The monument of which you lay the corner-stone to-day will be built in commemoration of no particular chieftain or hero, although you sent many from your midst well deserving of such honor, but in memory of a class whose patriotism, self-sacrificing devotion and heroism command the admiration of the people from whose bosom they went forth, as in time to come they will command the respect and reverence of all Americans.​
The monument which is to be erected by the patriotic ladies and citizens of Baton Rouge in memory of the Confederate soldiers from the Florida parishes who died in the war will one day be regarded by all Americans with the same pride and veneration as the monuments in your National Cemetery, which do merited honor to the heroes lying there who died on the other side.​
---------------​
I walk through the national cemeteries and the quiet ranks of the dead with respect and reverence. I honor the sentiment in the nation which thus guards and protects the memory of those who died that it should live. While serving in the Senate I voted with pleasure for every appropriation asked for for the purpose of beautifying and improving these grounds and their monuments. The noble stanzas written by a gallant Confederate soldier, now dead, which, cast upon enduring metal, adorn their walks and gates, thrill my every pulse with sympathy as I gaze upon the "bivouac of the dead." But while conceding to the fullest extent the honor to the victor, while claiming nothing from the government for the conquered, in pensions for the living or burial for the dead, I yet claim for them the right which belongs to all brave men, victor or vanquished, to honor the memory of their comrades who died in battle, to erect monumennts over their graves, or in commemoration of their valor, devotion and self-sacrifice, though their resting places may be unknown and their bivouac not "On fame's eternal camping ground."​
-----------------------​
Under its folds we are assembled to-day, we surviving soldiers of the Confederate army, with many of those who fought against us as our honored guests, to inaugurate a monument to those who fell in battle or died in the service on our side. There is nothing of treason, nothing of disloyalty in this. The men whom we desire to honor, less fortunate than we, were able to illustrate their patriotism only by dying for their cause. Had they survived they would have accepted the result as we did, and would have battled as courageously against poverty and discouragement to restore their country to peace and its former prosperity. They would as proudly have upheld its banner, and stood as ready to do battle in its defense. As departed American soldiers, their records are as bright, their spirits as pure and free from stain, their memories as glorious in all that speaks of duty nobly done, as if they slept as the nation's wards in yonder city of the dead.​
Living, they strove to do their duty. Dead, let no one challenge or criticise their motives. They have gone to a higher court for judgment. This stone is to be raised to commemorate their virtues, and the day will come, if it has not already dawned, when those virtues will be acknowledged of all men, when the Federal soldier and his descendants will stand uncovered before this monument, as we bare our heads when we pass through their cities of the dead.​
-------------------​
In memory, I see again these regiments and battalions starting for the front, with music and banners and all the panoply of war, and memory brings back to me, and to all of you, the recollection of loved faces and brave hearts of many who were marching in the ranks, and who are absent from our gathering to-day, who will respond to lifes roll call no more forever— who are memories now. Of those whom to-day we honor. We cannot strew flowers upon their scattered graves ; we cannot mark their unknown resting places with stone or monument; we cannot gather their earthly spoil into beautiful mausoleums, or cities of the dead, but we erect this monument in their honor that all people in all time to come may know that the soldiers who died for the Confederate cause are not without love and honor and reverence in the land which gave them birth:
It's putting lipstick on a pig. We know exactly why the secessionists chose to secede they told us many times why. The Confederate soldier died so slavery could be expanded .
After the ACW defeated racists came up with various BS reasons to explain the ACW like tarriff's. Later they came up with the idea that the Confederate Army was racially intergrated so it couldn't be racist.
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Andersonh1

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It's putting lipstick on a pig. We know exactly why the secessionists chose to secede they told us many times why. The Confederate soldier died so slavery could be expanded .
After the ACW defeated racists came up with various BS reasons to explain the ACW like tarriff's. Later they came up with the idea that the Confederate Army was racially intergrated so it couldn't be racist.
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Empathy is needed here, I continue to say. Even racists can mourn their dead. The victorious racists in the North put up their monuments at the same time that the racists in the South put up their monuments. I doubt very much that racism played into either section's desire to honor the fallen. The reasons they left behind indicate that race had very little to do with these memorials, and you've offered nothing to counter their words.
 

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Empathy is needed here,
The empathy is: we give the Confederate dead headstones and thier monuments can go up in cemeteries were they lay.

Empathy is not monuments in public spaces that are offensive to loyal citizens that stayed true to the flag.
 

Andersonh1

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The empathy is: we give the Confederate dead headstones and thier monuments can go up in cemeteries were they lay.

Empathy is not monuments in public spaces that are offensive to loyal citizens that stayed true to the flag.
Freedom of speech allows for things that some find offensive to go up in the public square. States and communities sent men off to die, States and communities memorialized them in the public square, as the article from the Aiken Standard reminds us. It's entirely appropriate.
 

Tom

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Here is the story first he the only Union soldiers to make this commit about Bradford. It only agreed that Bradford was not going to surrender the fort at any cost. Here is a link to story : it seems Bradford was signaling a Gunboat New Era with a dark blue flag .... The link:

A dark blue flag being used as a signal flag?*....that at closer range is mistaken for a black flag?

That is - if we are to assume the two are the same flag.

(*Signal flags are usually bright in color and have more than one color.)
 

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Empathy is needed here, I continue to say. Even racists can mourn their dead. The victorious racists in the North put up their monuments at the same time that the racists in the South put up their monuments. I doubt very much that racism played into either section's desire to honor the fallen. The reasons they left behind indicate that race had very little to do with these memorials, and you've offered nothing to counter their words.
Freeing slaves is not racist. It wasn't Southern whites that voluntarily chose to end Jim Crow in the South. Yes there is racism in the North and West but it wasn't Southern whites that led the way to racial equality with very few exceptions such has when Jimmy Carter was governor of Georgia.
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Freedom of speech allows for things that some find offensive to go up in the public square. States and communities sent men off to die, States and communities memorialized them in the public square, as the article from the Aiken Standard reminds us. It's entirely appropriate.
That should be up to each individual community. If for example the people of Memphis want to tear down statutes of NBF that's there right.
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Tom

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That should be up to each individual community. If for example the people of Memphis want to tear down statutes of NBF that's there right.
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So only the majority should get what they want, right?
Doesn't that work against multiculturalism and inclusiveness?
 

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So only the majority should get what they want, right?
Doesn't that work against multiculturalism and inclusiveness?
I can't speak for the African American population but if there were monuments to people who enslaved and raped my ancestors I could care less about multiculturalism and inclusiveness.
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Tom

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I can't speak for the African American population but if there were monuments to people who enslaved and raped my ancestors I could care less about multiculturalism and inclusiveness.
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My ancestors who fought in that war owned no slaves and raped no one.

But this is what the whole anti-monument thing is about - pitting race against race. Stirring the pot.
Gotta keep blacks in the Demo camp - especially in an election year.

Some people can't rest unless they've put in some 'good ole' race-baitin' for the day.

'Good ole' race-baitin'!

Biden with a southern drawl: "They're gonna put y'all back in chains!"

Despicable.
 

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A dark blue flag being used as a signal flag?*....that at closer range is mistaken for a black flag?

That is - if we are to assume the two are the same flag.

(*Signal flags are usually bright in color and have more than one color.)

The point is he was signaling a Gunboat... He was losing the battle. You do not raise a Black flag when you are losing.
 

Andersonh1

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My ancestors who fought in that war owned no slaves and raped no one.
Same here, and in fact all of them that I've found so far joined later in the war and for different reasons, so far as I can tell.
- one was conscripted, tried to go AWOL at a certain point, was brought back and ended the war as a POW
- one joined a month before he turned 18, so probably a young man who just wanted to get in on the fight
- one signed up and got a $50 bonus, which the CS government was paying at the time, so he may have joined for the money
- not sure about the other two

All of them survived the war, thankfully.

But this is what the whole anti-monument thing is about - pitting race against race. Stirring the pot.
Gotta keep blacks in the Demo camp - especially in an election year.
And the fact that I'm finding next to nothing about race in these documents, apart from the occasional comment by a dedication speaker, while there is a great deal said about honoring and remembering the dead, demonstrates that reinforcing the racial order was not the goal of those who had these monuments commissioned and installed. They were not about race, they were about remembrance, and still are.
 
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