Lincoln and the American System of Economics

[nicholls]

Lincoln was influenced by the American School of Economics for his support for public infrastructure and a Central Bank that issued interest free money.

(Re-)Introducing: The American School of Economics

When the United States became independent from Britain it also rebelled against the British System of economics, characterized by Adam Smith, in favor of the American School based on protectionism ...

www.dailykos.com

However, a libertarian took issue with it and had strong criticisms about Alexander Hamilton.

"You are describing a system that was contrived after the fact to give legitimacy to Hamilton and the Federalists, who did a great deal to centralize power, prop up a privileged elite, exploit the agrarian South and West to benefit banking and industrial interests, and ultimately precipitate secession and civil war.
The Federalists did a lot of damage through the Constitution and early legislation, but were so thoroughly repudiated that the Federalist Party folded into oblivion.
The Daily Kos article's contention that they supported "fair trade" is pure left-wing fantasy. There was nothing fair about their policies, which benefited the wealthy and politically prominent at the expense of the ordinary public."

Is it true that the North exploited the agrarian South and West to benefit banking and industrial interests and ultimately precipitate secession and Civil War?

I would love informed responses who know more about this subject.

 

[jgoodguy]

Lincoln was influenced by the American School of Economics for his support for public infrastructure and a Central Bank that issued interest free money.

(Re-)Introducing: The American School of Economics

When the United States became independent from Britain it also rebelled against the British System of economics, characterized by Adam Smith, in favor of the American School based on protectionism ...

www.dailykos.com

However, a libertarian took issue with it and had strong criticisms about Alexander Hamilton.

"You are describing a system that was contrived after the fact to give legitimacy to Hamilton and the Federalists, who did a great deal to centralize power, prop up a privileged elite, exploit the agrarian South and West to benefit banking and industrial interests, and ultimately precipitate secession and civil war.
The Federalists did a lot of damage through the Constitution and early legislation, but were so thoroughly repudiated that the Federalist Party folded into oblivion.
The Daily Kos article's contention that they supported "fair trade" is pure left-wing fantasy. There was nothing fair about their policies, which benefited the wealthy and politically prominent at the expense of the ordinary public."

Is it true that the North exploited the agrarian South and West to benefit banking and industrial interests and ultimately precipitate secession and Civil War?

I would love informed responses who know more about this subject.

Sounds too out of time band to be worthy of serious consideration.

 

[nicholls]

What do you mean by too out of time band to be worthy of serious discussion? It relates to the civil war.

 

[jgoodguy]

What do you mean by too out of time band to be worthy of serious discussion? It relates to the civil war.

Not in my opinion.

 

[jgoodguy]

What do you mean by too out of time band to be worthy of serious discussion? It relates to the civil war.

Before I put work into discussion, please have Lincoln quotes and Historian quotes to work with. All I see is random stuff thrown on a wall to see if someone reacts.

 

[Joshism]

The South has somehow always been the toughest guy on the block yet also the perpetual victim of insidious Northerners.

 

[jgoodguy]

The South has somehow always been the toughest guy on the block yet also the perpetual victim of insidious Northerners.

The Richest section of the country exploited into poverty by nameless Northerners.

 

[5fish]

Here Lincoln turns down Governorship of Oregon Territory... In 1849...

How Lincoln, Civil War helped shape Oregon

He gave Republicans their start in the Pacific Northwest and backed homesteads, railroads and colleges

www.oregonlive.com

.

 

[5fish]

The South has somehow always been the toughest guy on the block yet also the perpetual victim of insidious Northerners.

Woo... No, the South exploited the labor of black enslaved people... that is Insidious

 

[5fish]

What do you mean by too out of time band to be worthy of serious discussion? It relates to the civil war.

I would but you come and go so it's hard to debate you... But his economic history is way off... He needs to be schooled...

 

[5fish]

Here is wiki... overview...

American School (economics) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

snip...


The American School, also known as the National System, represents three different yet related constructs in politics, policy and philosophy. It was the American policy from the 1790s to the 1970s, waxing and waning in actual degrees and details of implementation. Historian Michael Lind describes it as a coherent applied economic philosophy with logical and conceptual relationships with other economic ideas.[1]

It is the macroeconomic philosophy that dominated United States national policies from the time of the American Civil War until the mid-20th century.[2][3][4][5][6][7] Closely related to mercantilism, it can be seen as contrary to classical economics. It consisted of these three core policies:

1. Protecting industry through selective high tariffs (especially 1861–1932) and through subsidies (especially 1932–1970).
2. Government investments in infrastructure creating targeted internal improvements (especially in transportation).
3. A national bank with policies that promote the growth of productive enterprises rather than speculation.[8][9][10][11]

The American School's key elements were promoted by John Quincy Adams and his National Republican Party, Henry Clay and the Whig Party and Abraham Lincoln through the early Republican Party which embraced, implemented and maintained this economic system.[12]

During its American System period, the United States grew into the largest economy in the world with the highest standard of living, surpassing the British Empire by the 1880s.

snip...

The "American System" was the name given by Henry Clay in a speech before Congress advocating an economic program[21] based on the economic philosophy derived from Alexander Hamilton's economic theories (see Report on Manufactures, Report on Public Credit I and II). Clay's policies called for a high tariff to support internal improvements such as road-building, and a national bank to encourage productive enterprise and to form a national currency as Hamilton had advocated as Secretary of the Treasury.

snip...


Opposition to the economic nationalism embodied by Henry Clay's American System came primarily from the Democratic Party of Andrew Jackson, Martin van Buren, and James K. Polk. These three presidents styled themselves as the peoples' politicians, seeking to protect both the agrarian frontier culture and the strength of the Union. Jackson in particular, the founder of the movement, held an unflinching commitment to what he viewed as the sanctity of the majority opinion. In his first annual message to Congress, Jackson proclaimed that "the first principle of our system [is] that the majority govern".[23] This ideology governed Jackson's actions throughout his presidency, and heavily influenced his protégé Martin van Buren as well as the final Jacksonian president, James K. Polk.

This commitment to the majority and to the voiceless came in direct conflict with many elements of the American System. The Jacksonian presidents saw key tenets of the American System, including the support for the Second Bank of the United States and advocacy of protectionist tariffs, as serving moneyed or special interests rather than the majority of Americans. The Jacksonians opposed other elements of Clay's ideology, including support for internal infrastructural improvements, on the grounds that they represented governmental overstretch as well. Several key events, legislative conflicts, and presidential vetoes shaped the substantive opposition to the American System.

 

[TomEvans]

Lincoln was influenced by the American School of Economics for his support for public infrastructure and a Central Bank that issued interest free money.

With "America" being the name of a sovereign nation under the sword, that was supremely ruled by a self-proclaiming elite under a patronizing facade of populism; not a voluntary international union of 30 some-odd sovereign nations that were each supremely ruled by their respective electorate, who simply delegated power to government as they chose.

 

[5fish]

We turn our backs on the American School of Economics for Neoclassical and Keynesian economics...

 

[TomEvans]

We turn our backs on the American School of Economics for Neoclassical and Keynesian economics...

A free market requires a free PEOPLE, who consent to their government.
Lincoln and Jackson represented industrial oligarchs, who were rapidly losing power due to growing franchise and increased population, which grew from the top 6% of 3.5 million people in 1787, to 44% of 31 million people-- in a time where each state was supremely ruled by its respective electorate, not federal government officials.


AND get MORE.



So they supported politicians like Jackson and Lincoln, who promised to INCREASE their power by usurping supreme rule from state electorates to government officials-- which meant that the federal government (and thus the Crony Capitalists who controlled the ELECTIONS), would be supreme over the states:



That's why the Lincoln self-coup became the rise of Crony-Capitalism, despite increased franchise and population-growth, which normally would have diversified the distribution of political power, like Marx expected:



Because Marx was a charlatan-sophist, who believed that simple free-market investing was a zero-sum game where the wealthy prospered-- and his deluded mind was unable to comprehend, that ABSOLUTE POLITICAL POWER COULD BE CORRUPT!



But fools think that a CONSTITUTION will save them from an all-powerful government, if they just VOTE for the right dictators...
that's why the Founders did NOT give supreme power to Federal officials, but STATE VOTERS in an international union.

But that was destroyed by the Lincoln self-coup, which usurped supreme power to the federal Crony Capitalists-- while fools like Marx blamed "democracy."

 

[5fish]

Lincoln and Jackson represented industrial oligarchs,

Jackson was a plantation owner, and Lincoln was a lawyer... yes, they were there as the industrial revolution took hold in America... The Industrial oligarchs came relatively soon after Lincoln...

A free market requires a free PEOPLE, who consent to their government.

NO this is a lie. Places like China and Vietnam prove this fallacy was a lie... The markets do not need freedom to work...

 

[5fish]

Marx was a charlatan-sophist,

Well, first you quote "The oppressed are allowed once every few years to decide which particular representatives of the oppressing class shall represent and repress them," by Lenin...

Sadly, Lenin's quote has come true here in the United States...

Marx was a charlatan-sophis

I would like you to go into more detail about this... You knew that corruption was a danger but his solution was incorrect "dictatorship of the proletariat" ...

 

[TomEvans]

Well, first you quote "The oppressed are allowed once every few years to decide which particular representatives of the oppressing class shall represent and repress them," by Lenin...

Some claim that; but Marx did complain that standard democracy didn't allow voters to recall politicians. Lenin didn't.

Sadly, Lenin's quote has come true here in the United States...

[/QUOTE]

THROUGH LINCOLN; who robbed state voters of their supreme power over their respective states, and usurping it to federal officials-- i.e. an oligarchy of 536 storebought-elected cronies, and their Nine appointed Nazgul.

 

[5fish]

their Nine appointed Nazgul.

SCOTUS only had six guys on it back then...

536 storebought-elected cronies,

You forgot that the states in the Confederate States did not send representatives or senators to Washington, and there were not 50 states in either... so the 536 is too high...

THROUGH LINCOLN; who robbed state voters of their supreme power

Could you give me details on this?

 

[TomEvans]

Could you give me details on this?

Each state was a separate sovereign nation that was supremely ruled by its respective electorate, under the original Constitution.


Therefore the historical facts do prove that a self-coup occurred, and that the current U.S. legal framework is the legal reality established by that event.

It is circular reasoning to use the post-Civil War U.S. legal framework to deny the interpretation that a "self-coup" occurred, because that framework is itself the outcome of the events of 1861-1865.

From a critical viewpoint, the U.S. legal framework (particularly the ruling in Texas v. White) is a post-hoc justification for the federal government's successful enforcement of power.

Using the current U.S. legal framework does not disprove the self-coup argument; it simply confirms the existence of the new legal reality that resulted from those events.

 

[5fish]

Each state was a separate sovereign nation that was supremely ruled by its respective electorate, under the original Constitution.


Therefore the historical facts do prove that a self-coup occurred, and that the current U.S. legal framework is the legal reality established by that event.

It is circular reasoning to use the post-Civil War U.S. legal framework to deny the interpretation that a "self-coup" occurred, because that framework is itself the outcome of the events of 1861-1865.

From a critical viewpoint, the U.S. legal framework (particularly the ruling in Texas v. White) is a post-hoc justification for the federal government's successful enforcement of power.

Using the current U.S. legal framework does not disprove the self-coup argument; it simply confirms the existence of the new legal reality that resulted from those events.

Did you read what you wrote out loud? You repeated yourself...

The Federal government expands its powers, and here is a link that will be helpful to you....

1860 Revolution Forgotten...

There was a Revolution in the 1860's America that has gone unnoticed by most of History. Many would say the only Revolt was the Southern state rejecting the union for their addiction to slavery but no there was another. Maybe, it was not a Revolution but a usurpation of power. The revolution or...

www.jggscivilwartalk.online